| An answer to John Loftus rather deluded article I found on the web called Top 10 Signs You Are A Deluded Christian At least he admits it is an opinion. I simply present the facts that show that he is over-generalizing and using simplifications which are not necessarily true. In fact most of them are bold assumptions spun from jaded minds that seem to believe that if you don't believe like them, then you are deluded. How deluded is that? Why are these kind of people so arrogant and mockers of believers? |
From Evernote: |
Top 10 Signs You are a Deluded Atheist
Fact by Charles G Pedley
Opinion by John W Loftus
I included John's misguided opinions first and then my answer in bold.
"Below in no particular order are what I consider the ten marks (or characteristics) of a deluded person. I think even some Christians will agree with some of them. You might want to consider from this checklist how many of them apply to you. To the degree that more of them apply then the more likely you are deluded by your faith. Now it's quite possible than Christians can be deluded and yet their faith is true, in the same sense that a person might be brainwashed or indoctrinated into believing the truth. But the point is that if you're deluded then you have no reason to believe."
A deluded person is more likely than not one who...
1) Was born and raised into his or her religious faith. Just taking the odds at face value this is non-controversial and undeniable given the number of religions propagated around the globe and adhered to with utter and complete confidence as the one true faith.
Answer: No. A deluded person may be someone who thinks they know better than anyone else, especially those with OPPOSING beliefs. That is also a sign of arrogance, and egocentricity. Atheism too is a religion. It is a faith in whatever materials or people that convinced you of your atheistic beliefs. Instead of a church's beliefs, you accept the "reasoning" of others because you choose to.
2) As an adult never adopts nor cultivates the adult attitude of doubt. All adults must revisit the religious faith taught to them by their parents, since #1 above is undeniably true. That means they must doubt. Doubt is the adult attitude.
Answer: Doubting is NOT adult. It is common in humanity. Being a teacher for 34 years and a parent, I have met all kinds of doubt. Again this statement is one of arrogance. The unwritten thought is "I doubted when I became an adult so therefore ALL people should doubt if they are really adults."
3) Never reads widely or is exposed to other points of view in the media. I'm talking about non-fiction works about the sciences, different cultures
Answer: Nothing wrong with any of the above, BUT if you swallow wholehog everything you see in them, then you are deluded yourself, especially if you ignore checking the works of others who DOUBT ideas presented on the above sources! Believing everything one sees in a science textbook or a program on TV, or another faith is simply substituting faith in one set of sources for others! Now believing everything you see means you have FAITH in those sources. So you have discovered a NEW BIBLE.
4) Does not travel widely including travel into different cultures. A deluded person only experiences a small slice of the pie. One must experience the world to see how others live. The more the better.
Answer: Traveling may be a source of knowledge. However many cannot travel widely. I certainly would not write off the reasoning powers and inteligence of anyone JUST because they do not travel "widely .... how wide is widely" Travel is NOT a prerequisite to reason or you may have to strike all knowledge in the world before some date where widely available modern methods of transportation were even available or affordable. And John, more is not always better. That is why drinking some water is good for you but trying to drink an ocean results in loosing your life.
5) Stays within the social confines of like-minded religious people. The Amish are the extreme examples of this. Many believers only have believing friends. Even if believers cannot travel the world they can still step outside their social grouping to meet other people who think differently. Most believers do not trust people of different faiths or non-believers. Seek them out. Attend a freethinker's group meeting. Get to know them. Become friends with them.
Answer: Why? What will that do for you when we live in an age where so many ideas that do not agree with our own are rampaging through modern media. Nothing wrong in associating with others. But the idea of "freethinkers" is an arrogant idea. Freethinkers are those who think freely. If you think that other people do not think freely then you are assuming you do and they don't. So would Peter Hitchens for one example be a freethinker? According to this author, one would assume not. It seems like "freethinkers" are those who think freely like other deluded "freethinkers". If you DO NOT think like them then you are what "slavethinkers"? How arrogant and patently untrue!
5) Never studies deeply into the nature of his or her adopted faith. The more you know the less you believe, the less confident you become, the more you doubt.
5) Never studies deeply into the nature of his or her adopted faith. The more you know the less you believe, the less confident you become, the more you doubt.
Answer: Doubting is not wrong. David doubted and God said that David was a man after his own heart. But the simple act of doubting means nothing. Children say "I doubt it." all the time. Any idiot or genius can doublt. But if you do not look at both sides of an issue then you are deluding yourself. For example how many atheists would read about the conversion to Christianity on atheists? I haven't heard of any. But it seems to me that atheists want to associate and read what ONLY other atheists say because only "they" are "freethinkers". But how can you be a free thinker if you eliminate the works of INTELLIGENT PEOPLE of OPPOSING VIEWS?
7) Preaches to people who think differently rather than rationally engaging them. I am constantly amazed, bewildered, frustrated, and bored with the kind of responses I see from believers who comment here at DC. They come here preaching. They pontificate. They quote mine from the Bible . They even say we're going to hell with glee. Many of them merely mouth the words of the creeds and affirm what they believe rather than actually engaging us with a rational discussion about the basis for believing in the first place. They come here preaching to us from an ancient superstitious set of texts we don't believe rather than showing us why we should believe it.
7) Preaches to people who think differently rather than rationally engaging them. I am constantly amazed, bewildered, frustrated, and bored with the kind of responses I see from believers who comment here at DC. They come here preaching. They pontificate. They quote mine from the Bible
Answer: How ludicrous! You are PREACHING ABOUT CHRISTIANS being deluded! So ONLY YOU are allowed to preach? How arrogant is that? Right now I am preaching about how atheists like you may be DELUDED. But perhaps you are so deluded you cannot see that you are?
8) Claims he or she does not need evidence to believe. Take notice Alvin Plantinga and Bill Craig! This is utterly delusional thinking especially when we consider all of the things they must take as properly basic beliefs coming from the witness of the Holy Spirit
Answer: Remember the FAITH OF ATHEISM also needs evidence. So let us see your evidence. Prove that God does NOT exist.
Just because you have not seen him, does not mean God does not exist. Perhaps you have not looked in the places like Peter Hitchens, Michael Coren and others have in order to find God.
Imagine how silly their argument is if we compare it to lost keys. Situation: You cannot find your car keys. You look everywhere you can think of but cannot find them. So you borrow your wife's keys and assume that YOUR KEYS NO LONGER EXIST because YOU did not find them.
Is that a rational conclusion? Of course not. And it is NOT rational to say God does not exist because you are not a good enough searcher to find him as believers have.
All around me I see evidence of a design. Modern space travel marvels us, but it came from design, not accident.
Accidents like the Challenger end in disaster.
I look around and in general I do not see the Earth as being the result of a disaster.
Disasters like the quake in Japan, exhibit chaos, the disorganization of formerly organized things. Earth shows organization NOT disorganization. That is evidence.
9) Must be convinced that his or her faith is impossible before seeing it as improbable. Time after time believers will claim I have not proved that their faith is impossible, and so lacking this kind of proof they still claim to have a reason to believe. However, we're always talking about probabilities, so even if it's still possible to believe in light of a number of problems for faith it's still an improbable faith.
Answer: Do you ever listen to yourself? YOUR faith is that of an atheist that requires absolutely no proof of the non-existence of God. You cannot prove that someone's faith is improbable unless you have ALL KNOWLEDGE. Surely you do not claim that! IF you do your faith is in YOU and YOUR REASONING, whether faulty or not. So are you saying you are more intelligent then all the great minds in the present day and in the past who ever were Christians? If you do, what kind of arrogance is that? If you don't then you are starting to face the reality that maybe you have gone from one "delusion" to another delusion.
10) Must denigrate the sciences in order to have faith. This is what I see time after time. Believers denigrate the sciences is a number of ways in order to believe. That's because faith demands it. Some believers don't even know what I'm talking about. That's what I think. Since science tells us prayer doesn't work then it doesn't work. It tells us the universe is 13.7 billion years old. It tells us we evolved. It tells us there was no Israelite Exodus from Egypt. It tells us the Nativity stories in the Gospels could not be true. It tells us virgins do not have babies. It tells us that dead people do not bodily rise from the grave. Christians must denigrate science in order to believe. Science or Faith? Science has a track record. Faith flies planes into buildings. Science all the way, hands down. End of story.
Answer: [Do you notice how John, like all agnostic-atheists do, can not help but get emotional and fling adulterated opinions and accusations out like flies around cow-terds? When will atheists simply respect those who believe differently? ]
Science DOES NOT tells us prayer does not work! In fact many recent studies have shown that a patient who has faith or not who is prayed for has a better chance of getting better than one who is not prayed for.
Science does not talk about "prayer". If it did, then it would become a philosophy, faith or religion itself. Science investigates ideas and finds proof for them. If it is not testable and repeatable then it is not science but has entered the realm of bias or faith.
Science tells us stuff that usually happens. It cannot deny that people have come back from the dead as Jesus Christ did, or people who have been declared legally dead have become alive again.
There are many things the god of science cannot explain. In fact if you go back far enough, science could not explain the hoax it believed in for about 40 years called Piltdown Man.
There are phenomena that occur that science does not have all the answers to. There are ideas taught in the 50's and 60's that now science declares were wrong. Science often comes up with a new conclusion to explain how a previously accepted fact has been shown not to be true.
And also his statement "Faith flies into buildings" is so ridiculous.
Deluded faith can fly into buildings. It can also write on blogs that Christians are deluded while at the same time not recognizing its own delusions.
Faith in no-God flies out of the mouths of childish atheists who think ONLY THEY ARE INTELLIGENT and right. According to them, if you believe you are stupid, but if you don't believe, then you are intelligent.
Isn't that like the childish assertion that everyone else is stupid but you? How adult is an arrogance of superiority?
I would also suggest that John Loftus, former deluded Christian, now deluded atheist associate with Christians who are at least as smart as he thinks he is and then see who is the most deluded. To belittle those who cannot answer him is again a childish mocking like we as children did when we called others names. How adult is that John? Come on. At least get honest.
See Prayer and Healing
Dissent from Darwinism
Evolution News
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